into reruns already
Jan. 25th, 2008 03:45 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
davemerrillToo busy and my scanner is in a box, so the Let's Anime this week is a column about parody dubbing that I ran last March over at Anime Hell, and earlier it appeared at the Athenstown newspaper, I believe. Newly updated with anecdotes from Pinesalad Production's Alan!
http://letsanime.blogspot.com/
By the way, you know what's awesome? Those new Puffs tissues that are impregnated with the menthol smell of Vicks. They are awesome. You get a box of those and that's a weekend right there, man, the Puffs is a four-way trip baby! They'll probably find out it causes brain damage soon, so stock up now.
http://letsanime.blogspot.com/
By the way, you know what's awesome? Those new Puffs tissues that are impregnated with the menthol smell of Vicks. They are awesome. You get a box of those and that's a weekend right there, man, the Puffs is a four-way trip baby! They'll probably find out it causes brain damage soon, so stock up now.
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
no subject
Date: 2008-01-25 11:30 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-01-26 12:06 am (UTC)Anyway, interesting read. I hope the move goes smoothly. I'd offer to help, if I had a passport. Not to mention the 6 hour drive one way...
no subject
Date: 2008-01-26 03:34 pm (UTC)Sherbert Productions used to bring their kind of lame parodies to conventions and beg for a time slot to show them, since they would not under any circumstances make copies for people because they were afraid of being sued. That was their excuse anyway, I believe they just didn't want to be bothered making copies, and maybe they figured if they held on to their films they might get invited to more conventions. They made up their own satin baseball jackets with the logo of one of their parodies - a Jurassic Park logo with a Ranma silhouette instead of the dinosaur. Yeah, that's right, four doughy fanboys trucking all over hotel function rooms with their own little street gang jackets.
As Corn Pone Flicks we had friendly rivalries with the other outfits and even had a yearly water gun fight with Pinesalad on several occasions, but those Sherbert guys were too full of themselves - and they did not have the product to back it up.
no subject
Date: 2008-01-26 04:50 pm (UTC)I do know that Phil Foglio WAS honestly concerned about being sued over You Say Yamato.
no subject
Date: 2008-01-27 03:38 pm (UTC)I believe the main reason Sherbert didn't make copies is to increase their own importance, yes. The one year they came to AWA I remember seeing them at the airport in their custom jackets. Sheesh.
no subject
Date: 2008-01-27 10:13 pm (UTC)Man, you just don't see dedication to someone's ego like that anymore, do you?
When was the last time you ran into the parody dub tape creating crowd last, Dave?
no subject
Date: 2008-01-28 03:04 am (UTC)Of course we haven't dubbed any parody anime in like ten years, but there you go.
no subject
Date: 2008-01-28 05:27 am (UTC)I'm kinda sorry that CPF didn't do a parody sub of that Great Mazinger, Grandizer, Getta Robo G robot army featurette. That giant sea monster would be a great metaphor for America, don't you think?
no subject
Date: 2008-01-28 02:28 pm (UTC)The thing about the Sea Monster movie is that it's mostly them fighting the sea monster, and that's not that funny in and of itself. There aren't any aliens or monsters or devils. We used the trailer, though.
no subject
Date: 2008-01-28 05:15 pm (UTC)And then there's the whole part of the Boss Borot melting in the stomach of the monster except for the head (which is the only part made from Ultra Alloy Z) and Boss FREAKING OUT over the only way out being...THE POOP CHUTE.
Oh, there's comedy gold there.
no subject
Date: 2008-01-28 06:18 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-01-26 07:36 pm (UTC)I did hear a new parody series that sounded interesting, or maybe because one of the dealer's I was next to was playing it all the time in between AMVs, parody commercials and AMV Hell and it got drilled into my head. It involved Yu-Gi-Oh and was as much a parody of the American dub job as it was anything else. Maybe it was because they boiled it down to how silly the original idea was: "In order to avenge you beating up my friend, I'm going to challenge you to a children's card game!"
Sherbert and Pinesalad
Date: 2008-05-10 09:07 pm (UTC)For the record, Sherbert did not do the same episodes that Pinsalad did. And as for Macek? He was fair game to most fan parodies, and I believe I’ve seen a jab at him from a 2005 parody called “This is Otakudom.” Some things will never change in that respect.
Pinesalad was the equivalent to our hometown rival. We shared the same territory in California, we went to the same clubs, the same conventions, and shared much in how we thought about anime in general. Not to put CPF down, but I’d be more exited showing our latest against Pinesalad, especially if they ever came back, then to go back to back with CPF because I’ve never really sat down to watch their stuff and really enjoy it. I can at least say that about all of Pinesalad’s works, including the Robotech stuff they did.
no subject
Date: 2008-01-28 10:06 pm (UTC)I have a tendency to be a bit of a packrat, trying to justify it as archiving. I'd kinda like to see odd bits of fandom and preserved so we can enjoy them in the future, after pretty much everyone has forgotten about them, either on their own merit, or by getting a laugh at how bad they are.
Hey Dave - It's been 11 years but...
Date: 2008-05-10 06:09 pm (UTC)What? You actually thought you were here to talk about your stuff too? This is our panel!"
As for fear of lawsuits - I did state that (back then); we didn't make copies because we were indeed scared of having to defend against possible legal action; and a member of your group responded with:
"Hey, we'd love a C&D (Cease and Desist) letter; hell I'd frame it on a wall."
then someone else from Corne Pone on the panel said later on:
"Hey remember when we were contacted by a lawyer from the company who owned the U.S. rights to 'Space Cruiser Yamato' "?
and another member of your group on that Panel responded:
"Yeah, I was like 'Star Dipwads', hey what's that? Yeah, I we acted like we never heard of 'Space Cruiser Yamato'!"
You might ask why I have such a clear memory of that little exchange, but it's because my group found it funny that within 5 minutes on the same panel you guys first stated "Hey, bring on a C&D letter"; and then one of your group puts his foot in his mouth by relating what happened when you guys ACTUALLY encountered such a situation. As for what caused me to make that decision for Sherbert? Well, at 'Anime America' in 1992 (that Con no longer runs, it was swallowed up by Anime Expo) - we were showing our "Urusei Yatsura: Attack Sherbert" parody in our party room; and after the showing, a fan came up to me and said,
"Interesting. But you're going to have to give me a copy since I own the rights to that..."
and, as I turned to face the fan, thinking "Yeah, right; well that's a new one..."; I then noticed that his Con member badge was a different color with nicer artwork, and the name read, "Robert Woodhead".
So, needless to say, I went pale, and he was rather nice about the whole thing; but still at that point in time (you might remember the group RW tried to start to begin taking action against fan subber distribution mostly - called JAILED was just taking shape; and while it did go nowhere in the end, it weighed on our minds as we did stuff).
But, yeah, it looks like we at Sherbert Productions in actuality were not the ONLY group worried about legal action - we were just more up front and honest with fandom regarding our concerns; but (and you know this all too well I'm sure); with what it costs a group (both in time and out of pocket) to produce parodies on the level the SHerbert Productions did; I will say that it didn't bother me in the least to not kill another VCR making copies that would have ended up on some illegal dealer's table down the road; or some guys would claim they made the parodies, etc.
Also, if you're going to talk about the make up of the group from Sherbert Productions that attended AWA 1997 - at least get the group makeup right. We we're 'four doughy fanboys'; we were 'two slightly obese fanboys with two rather nice looking fangirls' (both who were part of the cast in our parodies over the years.
BTW - We've kept an eye on Anime company trends and softened on our no distribution policy in a sense. We still don't make physical copies; but we have posted our "Ranma 1/2: Summer Vacation" parody on Veoh. It's the one you seem to remember as you saw the logo on the jackets we had made for the cast.
It's at:
http://www.veoh.com/videos/v1344062e4RJqDF7
hell, we even have such large egos that we put up the blooper reel to it too (so you can all laugh at our crummy job further) at:
http://www.veoh.com/videos/v1380054bSWYgmMr
(Continued next post too as I exceeded the charter limit it seems)
Re: Hey Dave - It's been 11 years but...
Date: 2008-05-11 07:03 am (UTC)First of all, I'm amused that someone has managed to get so far through life without realizing that there is no "e" in the word "corn." On to the actual point:
At no point in that panel-and I WAS on it-did we ever tell you "this is our panel," because we had always shared the parody panel with other groups since A-Kon had started. I remember it as the panel where you guys never said very much and didn't seem very enthusiastic about talking about your own work. Hence, we did a great deal of the talking.
In regards to any "ceast and desist" orders, I can clarify this quite succinctly: it never happened. I did get up and say quite loudly to the people who were filming the panel that we had no problems with sending out our stuff, and anyone who had a problem with that could come and sue us. 11 years later, no one has sued us. No one from Voyager (the company owning Yamato) ever contacted us for any reason, and we have never denied to anyone making Star Dipwads. It's still up on our website, big as life. What DID happen was that one guy sent in a request on legal letterhead because he just happened to work at a law firm and wrote his letter on company stationary. We wrote back asking if this was a legal matter, he said no, and that was that. A few years afterwards, we did get emailed by a lawyer working for ADV regarding a non-parody sub of Queen Emeraldas we'd done, asking for "sales accounts" and such nonsense. We pointed out to him that the website was quite clear on the whole "free" issue, our translation come first and was not based on theirs, we weren't selling the videos, it was fair use, and please go away. He responded saying he needed to go "check some stuff," basically, and that was the last we ever heard from him.
There's plenty of people out there who don't like our stuff, either-even I don't like much of it anymore-but I don't feel the need to spend my time tracking them down to tell them how wrong they are.
By the way, the word is actually spelled "sherbet."
Sherbert and Sherbet are both correct
Date: 2008-05-11 05:09 pm (UTC)http://www.bartleby.com/68/37/5437.html
*************************
Kenneth G. Wilson (1923–). The Columbia Guide to Standard American English. 1993.
sherbet, sherbert, sorbet (nn.)
Now the name of a frozen dessert, the word sherbet appeared in English in the seventeenth century, meaning “a cold fruit drink,” and developed two spellings reflecting its two pronunciations, sherbet (SHUHR-bit) and sherbert (SHUHR-buhrt). Today both spellings and both pronunciations are regularly encountered in both British and American use, to the discomfort of some purists, who argue that only sherbet is acceptable. Meantime, food fanciers have reborrowed this word in its French form, sorbet, pronounced both in the French way (sor-BAI) and an anglicized (SOR-bet). Standard English now uses all three forms, although Edited English usually clings to sherbet and continues to italicize the French sorbet as foreign. Australian English now uses sherbert, both alone and in compounds, as another name for beer.
*****************
Now for the sake of argument, let’s just say for a fraction of the moment we had made a misspelling with our namesake. What right do you or anyone else for that matter have to try to make us spell it the way you want us to? Have your ever seen “theater” and “theatre” when someone writes? Which is the correct spelling? Both are. BTW I was the one who spelled it "Sherbert" so it tends to be a issue with me when people try to bring this sort of thing up. Nothing personal mind you.
Re: Sherbert and Sherbet are both correct
Date: 2008-05-11 05:45 pm (UTC)The naming of names
Date: 2008-05-11 06:47 pm (UTC)10. Be accurate. Don't call us "Corn Porn Flicks" because that's not our name. Don't ask if we have anything besides what's listed on this site. We don't.
In case you forgot your own link where to find this then I suggest clicking on the link below
http://www.cornponeflicks.org/cpfcontact.html
Have a nice day now. I have to do some editing with Sherbert’s latest.
Re: The naming of names
Date: 2008-05-11 07:32 pm (UTC)Spelling "corn" with an "e" on the end.... that, however, is a new one you've managed to come up with.
By all means, please get back to work editing your latest fan parody video. The world is waiting!
Re: The naming of names
Date: 2008-05-12 04:30 am (UTC)In regards to the extra “e” that Phillip added to corn, well that was his error. I can certainly see you and or Matt being upset about that. I wouldn’t have responded to Matt at all if he simply complained about that, and had not insisted on adding, what I can only assume, was one last parting jab saying Sherbert was a misspelling. I felt it was necessary to correct him on that one point
And thanks bunches! Knowing that the world is waiting for Sherbert’s latest is a great comfort to me. Can I quote you on that when I make the trailer? ^^
Re: Sherbert and Sherbet are both correct
Date: 2008-05-11 10:49 pm (UTC)I checked, and you are correct. I defer the point on the spelling, which I would likely have never mentioned had not your friend misspelled our name repeatedly, "corne" not being a word at all. I note that as you have chosen the most minor, throwaway comment in my message to pick at, you are tacitly conceding that the rest of it was correct, and that there are no resource websites out there espousing separate but equally accurate versions of history regarding whether or not we ever received a Cease and Desist notice, and have wisely concluded that the accurate version is the one emanating from the individual to whom the event actually occurred.
Either way, however, your repeated assertion that criticism reduces to an attempt to control your output or enforce our views upon you borders on ludicrous. "Rights" have nothing to do with it. If I express annoyance at the preponderance of crappy pop-punk bands who feel the need to stick an arbitrary number in their name, is that really to be taken as a concerted effort to strongarm said bands into actually changing those names, particularly, as in the original posts here, the comments were not even directed at the party in question, but at a friend or friends of the speaker? You obviously went looking for comments referring to yourselves, and then, upon finding some negative ones, accused the writers of said comments of trying to tell you what you should do with your group, when they weren't speaking to you in the first place.
I fail to see what our dislike of being called "Corn Porn Flicks" has to do with anything at all being discussed here. If someone was writing of you and kept referring to you as Fetid Swamp Rat Productions, you'd be quite right to correct them. I simply don't want to be falsely connected with porn, and particularly when lived with my parents, didn't want videotape packages with the words "porn flicks" on them showing up. I didn't write to those people and say, "what right do you have to tell us to change our name?" because that's obviously not what they were doing in the first place. Incidentally, I don't need you to help me find material on my own website, which I'm quite familiar with and regularly maintain, instead of leaving it sitting for ages until it turns into an old folk's home for ten trillion spam emails.
I personally never really cared for Pinesalad's parodies, either, but Pam and Alan were fun to hang out with and I enjoyed seeing them. They didn't seem to care for our stuff, either, but they didn't come off as having a chip the size of Nebraska on their shoulders to anyone who criticized them. I can level criticism against anyone I want, anytime I want, and it violates nobody's "rights," whatever you imagine those to be. Why should you care what people think of you, anyway? I don't like Michael Bay, but that doesn't mean I think he's a wretched failure as a human being.
Incidentally, Seishun Shitemasu's website says you're lame. You might need to go bust their chops.
If it helps, I'll offer this: Our film, "The Making of Star Dipwads," was a poorly-written, badly-assembled, irredeemably unfunny pile of crap. Anyone else who says so is 100% in the right to do so.
Re: Sherbert and Sherbet are both correct
Date: 2008-05-12 03:58 am (UTC)Criticisms are one thing, but for Dave infer that we're:
"Four Doughy Fanboys with huge egos'; and that we were all wearing satin jackets with Ranma on the head of a dinosaur..."
And to be clear again, two of the Sherbert members were female (and not at all 'doughy' or obese) - goes a bit beyond actual criticism and honestly seems more personal than critical. You want to criticize what we've done? Great. But don't sit there on some high horse and try to say we must have some huge chip on our shoulder because we can't take criticism. But cheap shots based on a faulty memory can hardly be called criticism in my book. Please go take a look at "Ranma 1/2 Vacation" on Veoh and criticize away. I have no problem with actual criticism; and over the years, audience criticism has help us refine and improve what we do.
As for a large ego, do I and other members of Sherbert have them; and are they "larger" than most? Probably as many people wouldn't want to get in front of a microphone or spend hours editing a production for no compensation other than seeing an audience react. In fact, I'd say the relative egos of Sherbert Productions cast and crew's members are probably as big and swelled as those of CPF's cast and crew's members; as we do this for similar reasons.
As for Pam Buck, I have to say that I think in her case she was jealous of our technical ability and hated that if we were at the same convention; she felt we stole a lot of her thunder, and got upset at that; but again, what really bothered her is that she could never match our technical ability. But, that said, she definitely had a chip on her shoulder as far as we were concerned; and on a few occasions did get rather personal; so I responded by putting her in our "Dirty Pair II: Dirty Pair Does Disneyland" as a character; and had her bailing Adam Warren and Torren Smith (the guys who created the American version Dirt Pair comic of the 1990ies) out of jail. Also, things between Sherbert and Pinesalad mellowed and back in 1990; she even invited 4 of us to her Birthday party (and I still feel bad because when she invited us, she didn't tell us it was her birthday she was celebrating as I would have even brought a card). Still, if there's any 'bad feelings remaining, they're on her end. The only thing I will say is that it was interesting to see her over-react; or try to 'call us out' when we were at the same conventions. I actually documented some of that stuff on the Sherbert website; which has been down for about a year (believe me, I thought my Sherbert days were over - but that's another story in itself), but which I'll probably be putting back up on it's own domain within a month or so.
As for the Sheishun folks, they actually have a valid gripe because of a situation at Anime America 1991 that I to this day think was orchestrated by some members of Pinesalad Productions; but that's water under the bridge. Again, (and imo) it all stems from the fact that they couldn't match our technical ability back in the day of analog editing; and while I can say that I've never cared for their stuff either, I can acknowledge why they might still hold a grudge or something.
Still, I don't care for out and out personal attacks or gross mis-representations of our motives; and that's what compelled myself (and CorellianJones) to post replies here.
As for "Corne" not being a word per se; you are indeed correct; and I do apologize. But "Corne Pone" is a corn dish *(see this link):
http://www.rainbowgardensbookshop.com/cookbook.html
and I actually and mistakenly thought that's how you spelled it - but I was wrong in that and I do apologize.
Bottom line: Criticize our policies and our works all you like; but when someone makes some out and out unjustified and rather personal comments regarding the people that have worked for Sherbert Productions; you damn well better believe I'm going to say something in response as (imo) that crosses the line. I'm still glad to see some of the "old guard" from the late 1980 -1990ies of anime fandom still talking about the 'good old days".
A correction if I may
Date: 2008-05-12 05:47 am (UTC)**************************
They made up their own satin baseball jackets with the logo of one of their parodies - a Jurassic Park logo with a Ranma silhouette instead of the dinosaur.
**************************
I don’t really read it that Dave meant that we put Ranma on the head of a dinosaur. Just trying to be fair about this.
Re: A correction if I may
Date: 2008-05-12 01:25 pm (UTC)Re: A correction if I may
Date: 2008-05-12 11:19 pm (UTC)Re: Sherbert and Sherbet are both correct
Date: 2008-05-12 05:12 am (UTC)In terms of people posting about Sherbert, well they can do so, but I will comment on it if it suits me. I am part of that group, and if need be, I’ll debate topics concerning it.
You can criticize anyone you like, anytime you like Matt, but just be prepared for someone who can and will fight back. Just because I don’t usually debate people all that much doesn’t mean I won’t step into the verbal ring. Apparently you think criticism shouldn’t be challenged from time to time. You are right about your point about your website. You should know it well; it was a cheap shot on my part.
I cannot comment on “The Making of Star Dipwads” because I have not seen it to make make an honest evaluation. I can make remarks on Pinesalad and Shitemasu . And since you mentioned the later, I did visit their website and left Peter a review of their Ranma parody. It was the fourth comment down.
Link
http://www.seishun.org/2005/03/ranma-13-notes-from-closet.html
Sad to hear you have such a negative opinion about your own work. Not joking on that, seriously.
Re: Hey Dave - It's been 11 years but...
Date: 2008-05-11 01:59 pm (UTC)As I recall, Sherbert wasn't "invited" to AWA, you guys contacted us rather late in the game and we had to shoehorn in time for you to show your parodies, which as I recall - and admittedly my memory is faint after 11 years of scheduling the things - wound up being a really crummy slot opposite the costume contest, which was the only slot left.
Of course I might have been talking to you at A-Kon or something and said "You should come to AWA!" but since I spent most of A-Kon handing out flyers and telling total strangers that they should come to AWA, it shouldn't be considered an actual con-guest type invitation.
Dave! I never knew you were a fan of Sherbert
Date: 2008-05-10 08:25 pm (UTC)I have a few clarifications to make since your memory does not seem to be what it was. I, and only I, had the “Ranma ½” satin jacket you keep bringing up. The four members of Sherbert who attended Atlanta wore t-shirts with the logo. Another thing I’d like to bring up is at the time I was not merely dough-boyish, I was rather fat. I’d say that I’ve lost considerable weight since then, but I could be thought as dough-like now. I also remember you looked a bit on the Pillsbury side yourself, but I’m sure you’re past that now. Oh, that panel we attended with you? Honestly, if I had known I was only going to be allowed to introduce myself to the audience, then I would have much preferred to either videotape the panel or simply sit in the audience. I’m not exactly the talkative type, so I am grateful our one member did force his opinions into the one sided conversation that had taken place that day. I certainly hope this clarifies matters. It was good chatting with you, let's do another panel soon shall we?
I personally don’t care what you think of Sherbert, it's not your group, you don't have a say in it just like I don't have a say in CPF. I didn’t join a group to make fan dubs so fans can dictate what should be done with them, what parodies to make, and how they should be made. I speak only for myself when I say I do it for my own pleasure. I do not have to answer to anyone when I work on something because it is my time we’re talking about, not yours.
Mr. Sral (who posted anonymously) pretty much summed up everything else.
Continued from Above
Date: 2008-05-10 06:10 pm (UTC)BTW you may wonder why I've bothered to chime in after all this time; but actually, it's because that after 11 years, our egos shrunk a bit, so we decided for old times sake to inflate them again and do a new parody (we're in the post production phase right now, and if all goes well we will be showing it in under a year) called:
"Mighty Morphin' Iczer Rangers" (a sequel to a parody we did way back in 1992 called "Iczer-C : The Untold Story")
So, with all that said, nice to know you're still thinking about us after 11 years; and it's also nice to see how your ego has lessened in that time.
But, don't let me ruin your fun, please all, continue with the Sherbert Productions parody bashing. ;)
Re: Continued from Above
Date: 2008-05-10 06:19 pm (UTC)Re: Continued from Above
Date: 2008-05-10 10:26 pm (UTC)I'm pretty sure any contact we'd had with a lawyer representing the copyright holder for Space Cruiser Yamato would be a serious case of mis-delivered mail.
Matt DID get blanks and a request for copies from a guy who worked at a law firm, and as I recall there were some jokes about that, but boy oh boy, an actual C&D letter would have been like gold.
You may be happy to learn that CPF hasn't produced a parody dub in, what, 15 years? and has not hogged the podium at anime con panels since something like 1999 or 2000... I forget.
I wish you luck in your new endeavours, and I apologize for the insulting tone of my 11-year old impressions.
Re: Continued from Above
Date: 2008-05-10 10:44 pm (UTC)